tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post6448221880494751894..comments2024-03-26T05:16:17.432-04:00Comments on TV Republik: RECAP: Beauty and the Beast – Episode 12 – Cold TurkeyTVEmpresshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11324428867353988526noreply@blogger.comBlogger26125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-58007902817628096322015-03-18T19:17:29.011-04:002015-03-18T19:17:29.011-04:00I miss one thing in this recap and in all comments...I miss one thing in this recap and in all comments. When Vincent and Alex drive to the cabin, he says something like 'if we move forward'. He doesn't say 'when'. That's the ultimate sign to me, that he never choosed Alex. So how can Cat be the second choise, if he never prefered Alex? After Alex' rejection he could have leave to be a doctor in Mexico anyway. But he didn't. He choosed loved over profession.<br />In many recaps and comments before you wrote about what Cat said and what she actually meant. At one scene in this episode it would have been written, too, but nobody did. I mean the very last scene when she says 'i have to protect myself'. To me she actually means 'From now on i do what i want'. The result can only be, never to pull back again. That's exactly what happens the next episodes. To me the whole Alex arc was necessary for Vincent and Cat to move to the next level. With clear heads, confident and always knowing what they really want :-)<br />Greetings from Germany<br />Iris<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-42808300005240556892013-11-10T06:53:50.252-04:002013-11-10T06:53:50.252-04:00No, not at all, I was not offended by your comment...No, not at all, I was not offended by your comment. I could tell you thought carefully about what you wrote and I appreciate that. I was worried I offended someone inadvertently.<br /><br />I understand how you feel, and that the writers never gave a satisfying explanation either on the show or on social media.<br /><br />Knowing how the TV business works, I do find it a little hard to believe this was simply about egos. Not saying the writers have or don't have egos... I really don't know... but an episode gets approved by so many ppl before it hits the air that having a writer 'force' his or her vision may be a little hard. Sadly I don't think writers have that much power.<br /><br />But as I said, I am not in the writers' room and I don't really know what happened. So as everyone else I am just speculating and I could be completely wrong. <br /><br />Now, the fact that they didn't give satisfying explanations online... I also sort of get it, you can't possibly please everyone with your product and there is only so much defending/explaining you can do... but I understand how that can be frustrating as well. <br /><br />In any case, it is completely valid for some people to be turned off by the arc and subsequent writers' reaction situation. I just don't happen to be one of those ppl and I know a lot of viewers agree with me on this and a lot don't. I think it was actually easier for me because I was able to keep enjoying the show and the fan experience, but if you are of a different opinion there is really nothing that can be done. I am trying to think of an example of a show I loved and felt they ruined but nothing comes to mind right now... perhaps I just have a higher threshold for writers' screw ups... haha I don't know.<br /><br />But just to be clear, I was not offended by your comment and I appreciate you taking your time to write down your point of view very much. TVEmpresshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11324428867353988526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-76021360658717713362013-11-07T10:11:56.861-04:002013-11-07T10:11:56.861-04:00I was actually talking about the nasty comments yo...I was actually talking about the nasty comments your readers left about the fans' outrage, not you. <br /><br />I tried to be careful and not offend you with my note, but, apparently, it didn't go that well. And for that I apologize. <br /><br />I never meant that you were trying to force your vision on people, I was just talking about how sad it's that we have to resume on trying to find ways to justify this arc so our show won't be damaged by it. We didn't need or deserve that. <br /><br />I know you want to see the writers POV and I think it's noble, but it's a lost battle. I'll explain in a poor analogy. <br /><br />A friend of mine went to France once and she told that you're not exactly welcomed there. I never been there myself, but since this person is one of the most honest persons I know, I'll take her word on it. <br /><br />She told that you can't ask for things out of the menu in restaurants there. If you drink your coffee only with milk, you can't order milk if it's not in the menu. Their answer to that is “this is what the house has to offer”. In other words, if you don't like it, go to any other place. I'm not saying that is right or wrong, I'm just saying that it's not the best way to treat costumers. <br /><br />The way I see it, that was what the writers were doing with this arc. They knew that the fans were unsatisfied and that we were begging for more clarity. Yet, their answer to us was “this is what the house has to offer”. That was practically what one of the writers told me when I complained via Twitter. So, yes, I think the writers went all evil and they were only worried about their own egos, throwing tantrums and demanding that people stopped bugging them and accepted things the way they wanted, like spoiled children. <br /><br />It's really sad. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-36225599660333956382013-11-06T07:14:04.652-04:002013-11-06T07:14:04.652-04:00Well, thank you for your kind words, I honestly ap...Well, thank you for your kind words, I honestly appreciate them. However I feel like I should clarify some things. <br /><br />When I say I don't understand why some ppl had this or that view, I don't mean I disregard everyone who had a different opinion than me. I wouldn't be very smart if I believed my point of view is the only one that matters. I have one point of view and I understand a lot of ppl may see things differently. When these ppl sustain their POV with intelligent arguments I completely respect it and understand it, even if I may not agree. The ones I have an issue with are the ppl who make radical proclamations about a storyline or writers' decision and I can tell they are making judgement superficially and w/o fully considering the issue. [I am not referring to anyone in particular BTW, just talking in general]<br /><br />Now, as you can see from everything I wrote I am the first one to say the arc was badly handled. And yes, I understand that because of all its flaws [which led to a lot of confusion and misinterpretation] it could have been omitted. My intention WAS NOT to justify the arc, my intention was to figure out what the writers' motivations were in the first place. And I do believe that, if handled properly, the arc would have had value to the storyline. <br /><br />I actually stick by everything I said, that's the way I see it. I don't think Cat was Vincent's second choice. I understand why some ppl may think that, but I don't. And I am not trying to convince anybody! I am just sharing my views, everyone is more than welcome to disagree, I seriously don't mind. I think TV shows like any other form of art are subject to the viewers' interpretation. The same product won't have the same meaning for everyone. Each person sees things differently, depending on their background and personality. I think that's the beauty of it, I personally always try to get to the root of the storyline because I am a writer and I guess I connect with the writing process.<br /><br />Because of that I do hesitate to place blame solely on the writers. I still think a lot of the story may have been affected by editing and that is post-production. I highly doubt the writers went all evil and tried to do wrong by the audience! That is the last thing a writer would want! Did they make a lot of mistakes? Absolutely, but I just don't think they did any irreparable damage... that's just the way I see it. And once again, I am really not trying to convince you (or anyone) to see it my way. But I would love it if you could accept that this is my personal view on the subject... not meant to do any harm or disrespect anyone.TVEmpresshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11324428867353988526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-79620922320140885542013-11-04T20:43:43.863-04:002013-11-04T20:43:43.863-04:00I want to start this note saying how much I apprec...I want to start this note saying how much I appreciate your recaps and all the effort you put on trying to explain this unexplainable arc because I know that what I'm about to say is not that pleasant. <br />I get upset with all the talking about how the fans refused to see things how they were on this arc. From what I saw around the net, fans understood Vincent's reasons, but, the way I see it, the outrage came from the way writers wrote Vincent putting Cat in second in every little detail.<br />It's really sad to see beasties trying to justify this arc. No, it was not necessary. If you take ep 09 and ep 14 you'll see that nothing changed. VinCat continue to look at each other like the rest of the world doesn't exist. And the whole arc was explained – poorly – in one ridiculous “doing the right thing” phrase. <br />It's even sadder to see someone as brilliant as you trying to find a point where Vincent chose Cat before Alex dumped him so beasties can convince themselves that Cat wasn't Vincent second choice. Yes, she really wasn't. Because Vincent didn't choose her at all. He simply went back to the only woman available after being dumped. With no alternative, what harm can do to settle with the woman willing to accept you back after being repeatedly disregarded?<br />There was no point where Vincent chose Cat. We'll have to live with the fact that Vincent is with Cat only because Alex rejected him. The writers fooled us and there's nothing that can erase that. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-18253370813236991402013-10-25T12:03:48.650-04:002013-10-25T12:03:48.650-04:00Well, as you said, it all comes down to bad writin...Well, as you said, it all comes down to bad writing. <br />My view of this arc could be completely different if the writers had included two lines on the text.<br />Instead, they put themselves in a pedestal and refused to acknowledge what fans were asking, hiding behind the lame excuse that fans weren't reading between the lines. <br />But that's not what happened. On the contrary. I saw a lot of beasties that understood clearly that Vincent didn't want to be with Alex.<br />And, yet, those two lines were still necessary. <br />I see what you meant when you said that, at least, Vincent said Cat wasn't his second choice, but, the way I see it, it was like throwing a bone to a starving dog. It's not enough, it didn't satisfied anyone and it's sad. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-62658159699127844752013-10-25T06:51:06.064-04:002013-10-25T06:51:06.064-04:00I actually think Vincent's attitude towards Ca...I actually think Vincent's attitude towards Cat was more a reflection on himself rather of what he thought about her. I think he never let go of the 'no-one can love me' mindset and was looking for reasons to justify his own obsessive idea that Cat shouldn't accept his 'beast self'. In this context Alex represented the blank canvas, the fresh start, untainted by the knowledge of reality and that's why he kept going to her... it was his own form of denial. Did he screw up big time in the process? hell yes... but I don't think he had, at any point, a negative opinion of Cat... even if it came across like that at times... I believe it was more about his own self-hatred more than anything else... TVEmpresshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11324428867353988526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-66636716912817960072013-10-24T17:03:54.581-04:002013-10-24T17:03:54.581-04:00My main problem with this arc isn't the doubts...My main problem with this arc isn't the doubts or unsolved issues presented on it.<br />I think it was pretty clear that Vincent didn't want to be with Alex. It was shown in every single episode. Vincent knew he didn't love Alex anymore.<br />And that's why I hated it so much. <br />I could understand it if Vincent had some kind of confused unsolved feelings. But he didn't and that makes all the difference. <br />I also understand his reasons to do what he did. <br />What I can't understand is why he had to pass through that crisis without showing any kind of respect for Cat. That's what really bothered me. <br />Even though he knew he didn't love Alex, he constantly disregarded Cat in her favor. Alex was the perfect woman in his eyes while Cat was the shallow woman that couldn't see past his beast-self. <br />That's what made me so mad. <br />Not once he let Alex's image be harmed - he defended her on the drug robbering - but he didn't miss one single opportunity to show Cat how low he thought about her. <br />Not once he defended Cat or reprimanded Alex for rubbing on her face that they were reconnecting. He let Alex hurt her repeteatly without any complaint. Even if Alex didn't know about Cat's feelings towards him, it's still very not "a man in love" attitude. <br />Not once he showed that he loved Cat, not to Alex, not to JT and certainly not to the public. That was what was really wrong with this arc. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-18176617005667671512013-10-23T23:36:57.035-04:002013-10-23T23:36:57.035-04:00I just have to disagree with one little thing. Vin...I just have to disagree with one little thing. Vincent did say to Alex AFTER she pointed a gun to him that he wanted "to get away from all with you (Alex)".<br />Although you were pretty good on clarifying some points and I never thought about him saying that he was glad Cat was there the way you did, I still think the writers messed up big time with this ep and that they DID make Cat Vincent's second choice. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-45633655474076824962013-09-15T10:59:48.424-04:002013-09-15T10:59:48.424-04:00The jog – I think V was looking for don’t go. Inst...The jog – I think V was looking for don’t go. Instead he got I am concerned about you going with someone who doesn’t know with what you are- disaster. Cat was looking for Alex asked but I am not going because you don’t want me to but that didn’t happen because V can’t accept himself. So the dialogue turns frustrating to them and us. <br /><br />In the cabin – I see V trying to tell her. But what a task to tell someone you’re not all HUMAN. Forget that Catherine is in the picture all together. There is a V& Alex relationship prior to Cat. V as a man-beast comes before Cat. For someone who hasn’t seen him it’s an impossible thing to utter and who wouldn’t be tempted with the selfish route- I would! Alex didn’t want to lose him again that she doesn’t even let him finish anything- understandably I guess.<br /><br />The convo between #vincat in the woods is the heart of the problem, V’s insecurities. <br /><br />Alex’s reaction is exactly what I would expect any reasonable person to do either. Let’s not forget that Catherine herself freaked out when she saw the beast all those years ago and she got use to the beast slowly. Remember the scene in the pilot when V beastes out and tell her to go and Cat runs and they was a look of fear on her face. So do we really expect Alex no matter what she says and how clingy sounded to accept him. Let be fair to her to.<br /><br /> <br /><br />At the end the “BATB dark ages” aka the Alex arc was brought to you the insecurities of #vincat, V’s inability to accept who he is and wanting to run, V being tired of being on the run 10 years, Cat initial push back to what she wrongly perceived to be a competition, V’s guilt over abandoning Alex. Had nothing to do with loving or whatever and this will be the last of what my thought on that Arc.<br /><br />@itslulim<br /><br />LulsAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-2646407433008042612013-08-13T05:32:01.005-04:002013-08-13T05:32:01.005-04:00I agree with you Julie but the problem is that som...I agree with you Julie but the problem is that some refuse to look deeper than what was presented at surface level when it comes to this arc. I guess it's easier to do that than actually unpack this arc for what it is. <br /><br />I personally feel that it also comes down to people's perspection of Vincent as a character. They seemed to view him as 'the perfect man', incapable of faults. This by putting him on such a high pedestal, when he revealed himself to be 'human' and capable of making mistakes, they could not handle it and thus why this arc is so hotly debated. Also, because of this, people refuse to see Cat at fault as well because they both contributed to the confusion. That's just my opinion. kiki09https://www.blogger.com/profile/11291956752826134513noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-357286126231989722013-08-12T20:27:55.305-04:002013-08-12T20:27:55.305-04:00the writers should have made them discuss his issu...the writers should have made them discuss his issues in the next episode and made it more clear for us and for cat Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-72700363159263717792013-08-12T13:29:16.903-04:002013-08-12T13:29:16.903-04:00@JulieChaston here. You said this perfectly, at l...@JulieChaston here. You said this perfectly, at least to my mind. For the most part this is how I also perceived the whole arc, and I get so frustrated with those who have missed all the nuances and see it so negatively. Agree that the writers (or perhaps the editors in the cutting room) could have done some things a bit better, but on the other hand they shouldn't have to spoon-feed the viewers either. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-61193799534484953282013-08-12T11:55:26.070-04:002013-08-12T11:55:26.070-04:00Thank you Denise, I am glad I can do my part to ma...Thank you Denise, I am glad I can do my part to make the wait for S2 a little more bearable :) Thank you for taking the time to leave a comment! TVEmpresshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11324428867353988526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-50338419388127669542013-08-12T11:50:34.433-04:002013-08-12T11:50:34.433-04:00Hi! Just wanted to say THANK YOU! for taking the ...Hi! Just wanted to say THANK YOU! for taking the time to write these great recaps. Love reading them and can't wait for your next one. You are a terrific and very funny writer. These recaps are a great companion to the episodes and, as I am addicted to BAtB, they make the waiting for the new season a little easier. Have a great day!<br />DeniseAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-39019887406220315652013-08-12T11:29:51.706-04:002013-08-12T11:29:51.706-04:00Thank you Sandy, I am glad you do :)Thank you Sandy, I am glad you do :)TVEmpresshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11324428867353988526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-61208692849512299062013-08-11T20:05:54.859-04:002013-08-11T20:05:54.859-04:00as always I like ur recapsas always I like ur recapsAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16414435291232287573noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-63344525214438748362013-08-11T17:12:39.218-04:002013-08-11T17:12:39.218-04:00I will definitely try to continue the recaps on S2...I will definitely try to continue the recaps on S2, I am just not sure if I will be able to post them after the first airing, but if not... hiatus, something to do during hiatus is always good, right?TVEmpresshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11324428867353988526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-44944643088489689812013-08-11T17:11:37.904-04:002013-08-11T17:11:37.904-04:00Thank you Lady in the UK :) Thank you Lady in the UK :) TVEmpresshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11324428867353988526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-70861073683169179262013-08-10T10:48:21.848-04:002013-08-10T10:48:21.848-04:00Excellent timing - this episode was rerun here in ...Excellent timing - this episode was rerun here in the UK the other day - although they cut even more chunks out - annoying. Didnt really get a lot of this first time around but now reading your spin on just how conflicted Vincent is about all this makes a bit more sense - he is all tangled up in trying to "do the right thing" - by everyone - and there is that enticing up to now impossible possibility of his having something of a life where he can be a doctor again - we have seen several times how much he loved that part of himself - no wonder he went further down the Alex path than his better nature should have allowed<br /><br />Loved this recap - will keep checking in for the next one<br /><br />Best regards <br />Lady in the UKAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-68947024596099725842013-08-10T00:49:36.105-04:002013-08-10T00:49:36.105-04:00Thanks. Enjoyed your comprehensive analysis of &qu...Thanks. Enjoyed your comprehensive analysis of "Cold Turkey". You coverd all the bases and discussed points I hadn't even thought about. You're my compendium to "Beauty and the Beast". Hope you continue the recaps in Season 2. Love your sense of humour too.<br /><br />I watched the original "Beauty and the Beast" with Vincent and Catherine in the sewers of NYC but I prefer this version. The CW's BATB is a fairytale but the storyline is more plausible. It's romantic without degenerating into mawkish sentimentality.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-43206430059592388222013-08-09T21:17:33.122-04:002013-08-09T21:17:33.122-04:00This is so true "he didn't believe anyone...This is so true "he didn't believe anyone could ever love him when he couldn't love himself". That sentence does summarize everything. I also understood the need to introduce Alex, but the arc wasn't well handled. I didn't hate the "silly girl", but I didn't like her either, there were moments when I just wanted to punch her for being so silly and just pushing the situation with Vincent (but then again who wouldn't). And you're right, what I love about this show is that the characters look real. I think that everyone wants a normal life, so why wouldn't Vincent do what he did? If they were happy and saying lovely things to each other all the time, then the show would be over and don't want that. I want to see the ups and downs and their struggles to be together.Romina Simonettanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-53480968634062299192013-08-09T17:16:21.439-04:002013-08-09T17:16:21.439-04:00we can sum up all his motivations in this sentenc...we can sum up all his motivations in this sentence "he didn't believe anyone could ever love him when he couldn't love himself "Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-23292697889178807652013-08-09T16:30:11.469-04:002013-08-09T16:30:11.469-04:00yes i agree with you and he said i told alex abou...yes i agree with you and he said i told alex about the experement it was like " she accepts the things that you don't " Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2713073643028066347.post-12790891892650472762013-08-09T15:48:34.732-04:002013-08-09T15:48:34.732-04:00I really enjoy your recaps! I also don't "...I really enjoy your recaps! I also don't "hate" the Alex arc. Could she have been written a bit better, sure. And things could have been more clear... at least to the audience. But having our two leads deal with the Alex arc, humanizes them. When I first watched this episode when Vincent tells Cat after the M-crew mauling, "I'm glad you were here". I took it literally, as in, I couldn't of handled all three on my own. But I totally see your point now. I also believe Vincent knew this entire episode (and probably at least half way through the previous one) that he is no longer in love with Alex. He didn't really want to be in the car with Alex, and he didn't really want to be in that cabin... with her. Every time Alex said "I'm in", he's rolling his eyes (on the inside) and thinking, "yeah, right. You say that now". I think you are right about Vincent. He knew that once he told her the truth, he knew this little fantasy of his was going to go poof. And he also realized how much he has changed/grown (as a person) since her, because she hasn't changed and he used to find her and things she did attractive, and now he doesn't. And I'd like to think that Alex wasn't really that dumb, and that she was just in deep denial. When he rescued her in Seeing Red, she kissed him, he didn't really kiss back. In the ice rink, she was leaning in to kiss him, not the other way round. When she dropped her towel, he didn't pounce or do anything, not even a quick fondle. And in the cabin, she was leaning in to kiss him, not him. Every time a "romantic moment" happened between them, she was the instigator. Vincent was always looking for an out. Remember at the rink, when they were talking before getting on the ice and things got a bit serious and she's all lovey dovey at him, he breaks it by pulling her onto the ice to have some childish fun. And I'll shut up now.akagreeniehttps://twitter.com/akagreenienoreply@blogger.com